Owner Surrender Question

In December we had an emergency call come in. Pug hit by car, family can't afford costly surgery want rescue to take ownership or their going to have to put their Pug down. Ok, we step in they surrender their Pug to us we spend $3000.00 fixing said Pug THEN they want to adopt her back!!! Then the emails start sometimes 2 to 3 a day asking how she is, can they visit her, can they see her at the vet, etc, Actually fill out and send in our Adoption application and want prompt attention paid to it!!

This is the 2nd time we've had to step up in an emergency like this and both times the families have done this!! To be honest, I know how hard it must be but I'm sorry I'm just at a loss.

Have other rescues encountered this and if so how did you handle it? I just feel like your damed if you do and damed if you don't, the grief we have to deal with is unreal!! Now we're the bad guys because we won't give you your Pug back for this to possibly happen again!!

Polar Pug Rescue will NOT adopt a pug back to a family who surrendered it because they can't afford its bills. Our policy is if you can figure out how to afford the pug's surgery, how will you afford future emergencies. We also don't donate to a pug's vet bills when that pug isn't in rescue.

We tell them that unfortunately we are not a philanthric (is that the word?) association. Our moneys have to be kept for the pugs in our rescue.

So far, we've had several calls for dogs at the ER after having been hit and owner's couldn't afford surgery--but in all cases, the prognosis for the dog was so poor and the surgical costs so high, I had to turn them all down.

We do get surrenders that weeks later the owners change their minds and harass me for the dog back. In all cases, I say no and I make a point of telling everyone who surrenders their dog that this is permanent and the dog will not be available for re-adoption by them.

I feel for you, Carol. It's annoying--to say the least.

I imagine you can stop them harassing you if you respond that the original owners are only allowed to re-adopt if they reimburse all the rescue's costs up front. Make sure that those costs include transport to and from vets, time spent on home care and board as well as the vet fees.
Bet you don't hear from them again...

Puggered wrote:I imagine you can stop them harassing you if you respond that the original owners are only allowed to re-adopt if they reimburse all the rescue's costs up front. Make sure that those costs include transport to and from vets, time spent on home care and board as well as the vet fees.
Bet you don't hear from them again...

You are very evil, Angela! That is a great suggestion.

northernwitch wrote:

Puggered wrote:I imagine you can stop them harassing you if you respond that the original owners are only allowed to re-adopt if they reimburse all the rescue's costs up front. Make sure that those costs include transport to and from vets, time spent on home care and board as well as the vet fees.
Bet you don't hear from them again...

You are very evil, Angela! That is a great suggestion.

I LOVE it! I have to say oh HELL no to adopting back to owner surrenders. What happens the next time there is a medical emergency? And when the medical emergency is a result of the owners negligence, like getting hit by a car, you can just say your policy is to never adopt to a home who has had an animal get hit by a car...unless said car careened into an occupied home.

I don't work in rescue, but the only time I was involved in a rescue involving an owner surrender who we were afraid was going to fight to get the dog back, we lucked into the best forever home for the pug . . . about 3,000 miles away in the frozen north. Possession is still 9/10th of the law and people who can't afford vet bills can't afford to chase their pug to Alaska. Just sayin . . .

smoochieface wrote:I don't work in rescue, but the only time I was involved in a rescue involving an owner surrender who we were afraid was going to fight to get the dog back, we lucked into the best forever home for the pug . . . about 3,000 miles away in the frozen north. Possession is still 9/10th of the law and people who can't afford vet bills can't afford to chase their pug to Alaska. Just sayin . . .

And I thank you and San Diego Pug Rescue for the opportunity to enjoy his company. He blesses all who get to know him with his happiness! It's contagious!


I think he's happy.. Here's a summer pic:

MJ, you have some well traveled pugs there!

NIPRA has had the same thing happen. There was a liver shunt pug whos family mentioned adopting it back after we had spent well over $3,000. I never thought about saying you can adopt if you can reimburse for the expenses. I have told the previous family that the policy is not to adopt to a family who has given up a pug because a dog is a commitment for life and if for whatever reason they were not able to honor that commitment then we do not want to place a dog with them again and have the same thing happen. I have been threatened by them that they will contact a lawyer, and I told them to go ahead as they had signed all rights over to our rescue. I don't know what would happen if they would go ahead.

I also found that if they call to ask about the dog, it is best to say they are already with their new family and doing well. That way, they can't have any hopes of getting the dog back. Even if the dog is sick or recovering from surgery, you could always say that someone wanted to adopt him or her and is caring for the animal while it recovers.

I too like Puggered's suggestion above. If they get rid of it..they shouldn't have it back (because it may happen again..you cant keep tossing a poor dog around like that, it's not fair). If they cough up the money to pay for everything you did for it, then possibly..but if not..it's not a way to get free services for families like that. If you cannot care for a dog, emotionally and financially, then you should hold off on having one until you can.

TNPUGMOMOF3 wrote:MJ, you have some well traveled pugs there!

I know. *LOL* I should call them the AT&T gang (for long distance, ya know...) Beau from Seattle, Chloe from Tennessee, Bozlee from San Diego... Odie Gus Gus & Rocky are local. Linda's Odie Mo & Diamond are from Missouri and/or Illinois, I believe.

northernwitch wrote:
We do get surrenders that weeks later the owners change their minds and harass me for the dog back. In all cases, I say no and I make a point of telling everyone who surrenders their dog that this is permanent and the dog will not be available for re-adoption by them.

It happened to me here in the UK on a couple of occasions, too. It was absolutely essential to have a watertight, signed Release Form stating that the handover is permanent and irreversible. But even this didn't stop them trying!
So I know how you feel.

I just volunteer so I can't speak directly for rescue. But honestly, if someone were to threaten to get a lawyer, I would tell them go ahead. If they don't have the $ for the surgery, they aren't going to have the $ to get a lawyer. Yes, there have been some high profile dog custody cases, but those are few and far between. If I were a lawyer, and someone came to me with this, I'd tell them to fork over the $ to pay the vet bills and leave me alone.

A couple of things, the pug was probably treated under your rescue's name at the vet's office. And I am sure that it was either paid for with rescue's cc or via check for either the rescue or a member's account. If the pug didn't have their name on the account and they didn't pay for 1 penny of the vet bills, then sorry, I don't really see that they have any rights to that pug at all, even without a surrender form! I would also kill them with kindness and reserve your for us. At least they won't ever be able to say that you were kind to them and their pug. Maybe you could say that if they reimbursed rescue for the vet bills, time of the volunteers, mileage to and from the vet for each visit, cost of phone calls, interest on the credit card; that you could see if the board would make an exception for them to adopt the pug back. And do it in a sugary sweet voice.

Puggered wrote:I imagine you can stop them harassing you if you respond that the original owners are only allowed to re-adopt if they reimburse all the rescue's costs up front. Make sure that those costs include transport to and from vets, time spent on home care and board as well as the vet fees.
Bet you don't hear from them again...

I was going to say something along these lines, there needs to be if there is not a clause in the surrender form saying if the original owners want the dog back they must pay all expenses incurred while dog was in foster care. That would pretty much stop them dead in there tracks.
I know for sure that if the owners of my Rupert could have had him back after $2,000 worth of ops they would have in a heart beat.
Sorry but there is no way I would ever hand back a dog in that situation. If you can't afford the dog in the first palce you should not have one.

I think most surrender forms state very clearly that the dog is now the property of the rescue. I make sure that owners understand this and that they will not be candidates for adopting that dog back (or any dog from us, really).

This is what ours looks like. We modify the "acknowledge the following" section based on the specific dog and the circumstances of surrender :

We, as owners of this dog:

Name:
Description:
Date of Birth:

acknowledge the following:
This dog is up to date on her vaccines. (Yes/No))
I am unable to continue to care for her
This dog was used as a breeding dog and is still currently intact. (Yes/No)
I have provided all the paperwork that I have on this dog.
I also confirm that all statements made on this Surrender Form and on the Dog Information Sheet you provided separately are truthful.

We hereby transfer all our rights and duties in this dog to Pugalug Pug Rescue (PPR) which shall have absolute discretion and control in and over matters connected with this dog. We hereby deliver up to PPR all available health records of this
dog. We also confirm that, to the best of our knowledge, this dog is in good health and disposition, and that all
statements made in this form are true.

We understand that in the event this dog shows signs of aggression or extreme behaviour in the next 30 days, PPR will take appropriate action to ensure the safety of all concerned.

Dated this day of , 2010 at , Ontario

Thanks guys for the great feed back on this. Our forms have been looked at by five different attorneys several in the animal welfare practice so we know they'll hold up in a court of law. But our surrender form does'nt state the owners can't apply for their Pug back so I'm going to add that in. We've been threatend before with an owner surrender telling us they were going to get an attorney we told them bring it on. It was actually the family that surrendered Lilo. They surrendered her and a fawn boy. They only wanted him back, she was the one that needed all the work and they never even bothered to ask how she was. We never heard from them again.

I just can't believe people really expect us to spend thousands fixing their Pug and then expect we'll just adopt it back to them. We did'nt give the first Pug this happend with back and we're not going to give Violet back either it just sucks we have to be harrassed and aggravated for saving a Pugs life.

Lilos Mom wrote:Thanks guys for the great feed back on this. Our forms have been looked at by five different attorneys several in the animal welfare practice so we know they'll hold up in a court of law. But our surrender form does'nt state the owners can't apply for their Pug back so I'm going to add that in. We've been threatend before with an owner surrender telling us they were going to get an attorney we told them bring it on. It was actually the family that surrendered Lilo. They surrendered her and a fawn boy. They only wanted him back, she was the one that needed all the work and they never even bothered to ask how she was. We never heard from them again.

I just can't believe people really expect us to spend thousands fixing their Pug and then expect we'll just adopt it back to them. We did'nt give the first Pug this happend with back and we're not going to give Violet back either it just sucks we have to be harrassed and aggravated for saving a Pugs life.

Oh people have more nerve than Carter's has liver pills. I know when I asked about including a statement about not applying to adopt a dog back, the lawyer I consulted said that I could say it, but it wasn't legally enforceable. Anyone can apply to any rescue at any time and there's no way to expressly forbid it or ensure that they don't apply--it's unenforceable.

northernwitch wrote:........I know when I asked about including a statement about not applying to adopt a dog back, the lawyer I consulted said that I could say it, but it wasn't legally enforceable. Anyone can apply to any rescue at any time and there's no way to expressly forbid it or ensure that they don't apply--it's unenforceable.

Let 'em apply.. Doesn't mean they'll ever get a pug from that rescue. *LOL*

Our little girl hit by the car "Violet" lost her tail on Monday, it died from the trauma. She now has a "nub". If you have'nt seen her she's on the front page of the website. She's very cute.
www.pugrescuenetwork.com