Angel's Check Up & Questions

Angel joins Lola and Sophie (and Bello for that matter) in the "Pugs Who Went to the Vet this Week" category.

I went ahead and had them do a full senior panel, urinalysis and updated heart enzyme test. (my wallet is still crying...)

She's down to 18.3 lbs, nearly another pound since November. She was 23lbs...

her kidney functions overall look good, as do her liver functions.

the urinalysis did not show protein which is good. it did show some crystals. the vet said he wasn't super concerned at this point in her life - the crystals can cause bladder stones, and the only "fix" for that is surgery. And he would not recommend surgery for her age. I wasn't sure about this - I know many of you have treated crystals with diet changes?

her thyroid was really low - 1/2 the low end of the "normal" range. he wants to discuss putting her on a medication for this.

her WBC's were pretty elevated, and he thought this indicated inflammation and possible infection somewhere. so he wants to discuss putting her on an antibiotic to treat.

she's currently on 1/2 tablet of TemarilP and 1/2 tablet of furosemide, and we've added a 1/2 tablet metrodiazonol for her upset tummy (soft poop and wicked bad gas, not to mention slightly bloody from time to time). We think the digestive issues are a result of her being on the TemarilP for an extended amount of time. The Metro seemed to really help her the last time we put her on, so we're going to add that to her normal routine.

oh, and her heart enzyme test came back at 765, and to quote the vet "900 is indication of a bad problem". so he feels that the furosemide and temarilP route are helping her.

all in all, not bad for an old pug with heart failure. (I was expecting much, much worse news!).

so I'm questioning adding in antibiotic, which is also known to be rough on the digestive track. I've added pumpkin for all of them, and that seems to be helping Angel just a little bit.

and then not sure how the thyroid med will help her. I think some of you have mentioned thyroid as an issue for your pugs - and it made a world of difference.

Can you share your thoughts/experience with the thyroid med?

what other questions should I be asking him on Monday when we talk over all of the results?

thanks!!!

oh yeah - and punk-ass Bello sliced the pad of his foot open when he was charging the fence to boss around the BT who lives next door. That was Friday's fun.... and Jessie is going in for her dental on Monday (my wallet, my poor, poor wallet!).

I don't have any advice, but am glad Angel's news wasn't too bad. Except for the wallet part. I always cry a little when I pay their bills...

My Tank is hypothyroid, but he was when I got him so I can't speak knowledgably about the build up. However, his meds have helped with skin and coat issues as well as weight issues--all signs of a thyroid dog. they have few side effects, are pretty cheap and worth considering.

Poor old Angel.

On the crystals, not a really good idea to change up the diet. Some dogs actually have crystals all the time, some hardly ever. More acidic can help one type (struvite) but more alkaline help calciun oxalate. So better to keep the urine more neutral....ph of about 6 works for us.

The one main thing for prevention of UTI is water, water, water. I give all 5 handicapped pugs, who are very susceptible, 1/3 cup water with a pinch of tuna in it 4 times a day. They think it is a real treat. Perhaps your pug is drinking enough on the furosemide anyway, but more water is always good.

I don't have any advice here, but I'll offer a prayer for your poor wallet!! and your Angel.

Blanche - I wonder if the thyroid is why she's been losing hair? her belly is pretty much bald at this point.

Joan - yes, she drinks like a camel! and pees lakes. oceans even...LOL I don't think he said struyvite crystals - so maybe the calcium version?

I just don't want to do anything to make things worse, and I hate the idea that she has so many pills - but if they are helping her, I will do it. (at least she's easy to pill...)

Oh forgot about the mteronidazole, I give Bella my diabetic pug (17 lbs) 1/4 tablet per day. 1/4 of 250mg=62.5/day. She is perfect on that low dose, and a lot of the dogs on my liver board (she has CAH) are on it for years with no trouble or side effects.
Recommended dose is 5-10mg/lb 2-3 times per day. So you can see this is a really low dose, but made the world of difference. Esp since being diabetic, she cannot be dehydrated ever. Lowers the blood glucose levels!

I thought she might ber drinking a lot with the lasix, and because of that I would not treat the crystals, they most likely won't be a problem. If you use the urine chemstrips say weekly, you will pick up if the ph changes.............more alkaline than what she is usually means a UTI could be imminent. Cranberry extract can acidify the urine slightly at that point.

I don't have any experience (yet) with thyroid, I am sure Blanche knows this.

Hugs Joan

I don't have any advice, Allie. Just sending you and Angel big hugs and prayers.

Allie, if thyroid problems in dogs is anything like it is in humans, it can cause hair loss. I just started treatment a month ago for my thyroid and was told that my thyroid being low is why my hair was thinning and falling out. It really can cause a whole lot of problems.

I'm glad your old girl's results were better than you'd expected.

Buster is hypothyroid too. He was started on thyrosyn shortly before we got him and it has helped TONS. The only thing we have to do aside from giving him his pill twice per day is go for bloodwork every six months. And that could definitely be why Angel's lost hair (it does cause hair loss), but it usually causes weight gain & you say that she's been steadily losing. That's kind of odd. I'm not familiar with her heart problems - does she suffer from an enlarged heart or CHF, Allie?

My Pugsly was on thyroid meds for many years. He used to have the thickest most beautiful coat then it became quite thin and brittle. He so may other health problems that I figured something else was causing the problem. Even with the thyroid meds, his levels were normal but at the low end of normal. When we moved to Tennessee, and I found another vet, I came him Pugsly's file which was about 3 inches thick. He went through all of it and said that there was only one thing he could think of doing differently. He wanted to increase the thyroid dosage since the level was on the lower end of normal. Let me tell you that increasing it made such a difference. Within two weeks, Pugsly's coat was already getting thicker and softer. Within a month, his fur and skin looked like it did when he was a puppy. His entire personality seemed to perk back up. A low thyroid can cause so many issues so I would definitely try putting her on the medication.

hi Brenda - thanks for the insight on the hypothyroid!

I think that's what confused me too - I thought if the thyroid was low, it would lead more to weight gain and low energy. Not that you could tell any change in her energy level (she's old, she sleeps 23 hours out of the day..), but she's definitely losing weight.

I guess the weight loss is just an age thing at this point. I'd feel a whole lot better about where she medically is if I can get a little more weight on her, and keep her steady. Her bones just stick out all over.

She has CHF.

I can't speak to the thyroid, but the vet I see now, who specializes in brachycephalic breeds, (Emmet is stone former, and had 2 surgeries with my old vet, who clearly didn't know much about stones), says that the current thought from U of MN is that if the stones aren't bothering the dog, then we don't bother the stones. Emmet currently has "grit"--well, that was at the last xray--I'm taking him in this week for check ups.

Hoping whatever treatment you choose works well for your gal!

I also wanted to mention that with female dogs, if they have small stones or sludge/grit in their bladders, they can often have a procedure called urohydropupulsion where the bladder is filled with water then squeezed to get all the contents out. The animal does have to be placed under anesthesia, but there is not cutting into the stomach or bladder. Chyna had this done back in April, and the doctors at the University said with females they can actually get some fairly large stones out this way instead of having to open the bladder.

The problem is if you leave the stones or sludge/grit in the bladder, a lot of bacteria can get trapped in there and cause infection. Also, with male dogs the tiniest of stones can block the urethra which could be fatal if you don't notice in time. With our Pugsly, we watched him for a year while he had ultrasounds about every 3 months to see if the sludge/grit was forming stones. Since the amount kept increasing, we finally had to have surgery for him to clean him out. He had already had one blockage during his life, and I was afraid to push it any longer.

My hospice pug Peachy was hypothyroid too and I couldn't get weight on her for anything. The vet had her on Nutrical and a/d for a while because she was so thin. She was also battling constant bladder infections, heartworm, pyometra, kidney stones/sludge etc. Since her thyroid is regulated now, she has a beautiful soft coat and has filled out. (By the way... animal communicator Linda predicted the thyroid in October and it was confirmed a couple of weeks later at her appointment and she also predicted the date of the negative heartworm test). Peachy is on .1mg of Soloxine 2x's a day. She had recheck after one month, three months, and now is on a six month schedule. As for the sludge, the vet has her on a capsule of Azodyl twice a day. She also gets a probiotic 2x's a day, Proin 2x's a day metacam/pepcid ac 1x day. When her infections come back, she has moved from Clavamox to Baytril. The vet also has her on a supplement called "Total Body Support" and she is on Solid Gold Sea Meal. In a year's time, she looks like a different dog.

Allie no advice here but give that little doll a hug for me.

TxAllieGrl wrote:She has CHF.

Aww, I'm sorry. It seems to be pretty common in older pugs, unfortunately. We gave Pugsy Coenzyme Q10 for her enlarged heart instead of going with conventional meds since hers was not too bad (along with fish oil & an immune booster/vitamin blend). I think that it helped her since she never got to the point that she needed Lasix. There's some good info. on supplements and diet for dogs with heart disease here, if you're interested (there's a section on hypothyroidism, as well): http://www.dogaware.com/specific.html#heart

I have no advice, but just want to say what an awesome pug ma you are and Angel thanks you!

Oh man Allie, it does sound like the babies are keeping your wallet light. Glad to hear Angle is doing better than expected. Good thoughts all around for your crew